Expelled Secretary for Administration and Security, Didymus Mutasa has said he regrets his time in government. Mutasa made these strong comments in a wide ranging interview with the South African Mail and Guardian paper.
When asked “do you regret any policies during the time you were in government?,” Mutasa was quick to admit saying, “i
n a way, yes. We have taken away people’s land and we are not making good use of those farms. When you see how many Zimbabweans are in South Africa, it’s millions. What are they going there for? It’s work. We draw up fantastic blueprints but with no money to achieve them. It makes me very sad. I have always wondered about our Look East policy that confines Zimbabwe to Russia and China. You then see how faulty some of our policies are. You never think about them clearly and they are given to you in a memorandum and when you meet your Cabinet and politburo colleagues to discuss them, you are told there is no time and we move to other issues.”
FULL INTERVIEW:
Dydmus Mutasa Speaks to the South African Mail & Guardian
Didymus Mutasa, the embattled former minister in the Zimbabwe presidency and the ruling Zanu PF’s former secretary
for administration, has staked his lifelong career in the party in a high-stakes bid to get his job back.
Mutasa (79), who has been with Zanu PF for more than 40 years, is taking the party to court in an effort to get the decision taken at its congress in December to remove him reversed. He was subsequently fired from government and accused of trying to assassinate President Robert Mugabe and former vice-president Joice Mujuru, who was also dismissed from the government and
party.
Mugabe described Mutasa last week as a “fool” for taking him on.
Mutasa (DM) last week spoke to the Mail & Guardian (M&G).
M&G: Zanu-PF appears to be at crossroads. Do you believe the courts will resolve this?
DM: I believe so, particularly if the courts concede to our request that the party should go back to the position where it was in August 2014. My own position is that there is nothing that I will gain personally from this process, except to bring back legality to the party.
What we are doing is for the benefit of young people, who do not want to be led by a group of gangsters who simply come up one day and tell lies and say to the president: “You are going to be killed” – and this is what this group is preparing to do. We feel that is evil and must be resisted.
We said the Ian Smith regime was evil, was illegal and we went to war on it. But we are not calling for war. We are just calling for reason. They told lies about the former vice-president and we have said: “Please prove it.”
M&G: They said that I wanted to kill the President together with the former vice-president. I said: “Well, I am the head of our security services and I am employed to look after him so how
could I turn around to murder him?”
It is unheard of and, as a matter of fact, that is why we are asking that he [Mugabe] remains the head of both conflicting groups and we discuss with him and we will be able to show him
how this other group has misled him.
You recently wrote to the Southern African Development Community (Sadc) and the African Union (AU). Will they involve themselves in the internal politics of Zanu-PF?
DM: When you do anything you don’t immediately think or talk
about how successful it will be. We are trying to eliminate all
possible reasons why our case might not succeed. We have come to the realisation of what could be done and what the potential of this country is, and this is why we are trying to mend our bicycle because it is broken down and we
want, after mending it, to ride it into the future.
As you can see, I am an old man and I gain nothing personally from all this. But I have got children and grandchildren who must live happily in the country of their birth and that is the main reason why we have got to pursue this case.
M&G: Is internal dialogue not a better option?
DM: Yes it is. When the president arrived last week he had to say what he did about me. I don’t mind that, but if he thinks that I am a fool then he must have been working with a fool very closely for the past 35 years, because I started working with him in prison right up to now.
The reason he gave me high posts in government was because he trusted me and suddenly, if he says this man is a fool, then they will say why has he not seen it before?
Why did you not present your grievances directly to Mugabe, whom you were known to have a close relationship with?
DM: At that time [before the December congress] it was impossible. There was so much violence [and] many people who
wanted to go to the illegal congress were barred from going there. A number of chairmen of provinces had been removed
and so the mood was very difficult . . .
I tried to discuss it with him personally but he was determined to go ahead, and he said: “This is none of my business.
This is a matter … being done by the women’s league and I have no hand
in it, and Mutasa you must understand.”
M&G: Should the courts not rule in your favour, what will you
do?
DM: We have got to sit down and look at what is possible. You see, this matter does not affect Zimbabwe alone.
It affects the whole of Sadc because Zimbabwe is one component of the Sadc and I do not believe that all these other
heads of state that we sent our letter to will just sit back and do nothing. Our letter to the Sadc was addressed to the president of Zimbabwe because he is the chairman of Sadc and that way I
thought we killed two birds with one stone.
I am waiting for a response to that letter and if he wants to publicise it, that is fine; if he wants it to be between the two of us, that is fine. You can’t dismiss [me] simply by saying we don’t want to take our matters out of the country. We must
understand we are living in a global village.
M&G: What will you do if you are fired from Zanu PF?
DM: I’ll do nothing and that is what they want. I’ll still live like I am living now, but I think that those people who will fire me will have a very bad conscience for the rest of their lives.
M&G: You speak of ‘we’ yet you are a lone voice. Why are the others supporting you namelessly?
DM: They should speak for themselves – I do not like to speak for them. I speak on behalf of people from my constituency, as
an MP. Nobody has ever said we want to see who these people are that you talk on behalf of in Parliament. Therefore, I am
talking on behalf of all Zimbabweans who feel something wrong
has been done.
M&G: In your statement earlier this month you spoke of “a dictatorship” in Zanu PF. Who is the architect of this
dictatorship?
DM: It’s people who have advised our President: Emmerson Mnangagwa (Vice-President), Ignatius Chombo (Local
Government minister), Saviour Kasukuwere (Environment minister), Jonathan Moyo (Information minister) and Patrick Zhuwao (Mugabe’s nephew). Those are the group of people who
have formed a dictatorship.
If this country went to war to achieve one man one vote, why should we spoil that? I am saying to other people: “Can you see what is happening to Zimbabwe and can you help us sort it out?”
M&G: President Mugabe turns 91 next month. Is he still the best
person to lead Zanu PF?
DM: At the moment he is our constitutionally elected leader. The
process of having another leader, I believe, should be done
lawfully in terms of the Zanu PF constitution, which was thrown
out.
Once that process is taken into account, then members of Zanu PF are given the right to choose their leader and not to have them imposed by the president.
Mugabe is a very good and fine gentleman. He is going to leave
somebody else and that’s our fear – that that somebody he
leaves behind will not be as good as he is and our country will
go to the dogs.
If the people say we want Mnangagwa then he has got to be
brought in properly and not be imposed on us.
M&G: Will Zanu PF pay the price of being divided in the 2018
polls?
DM: I hope not. This is why we are doing what we are to cleanse
our party.
M&G: Do you regret any policies during the time you were in
government?
DM: In a way, yes. We have taken away people’s land and we are
not making good use of those farms. When you see how many
Zimbabweans are in South Africa, it’s millions. What are they
going there for? It’s work. We draw up fantastic blueprints but
with no money to achieve them. It makes me very sad.
I have always wondered about our Look East policy that confines
Zimbabwe to Russia and China. You then see how faulty some of
our policies are. You never think about them clearly and they are
given to you in a memorandum and when you meet your Cabinet
and politburo colleagues to discuss them, you are told there is
no time and we move to other issues.
M&G: You are now an ordinary card-carrying Zanu PF member.
How do you feel?
DM: I am an ordinary person and I am very happy to be just that,
because that is where I started. My wife said that it is very good
that I have been placed where I am now because I would have
been in an untenable position. I agree with her, and I am quite
happy.
M&G: How do you spend your days?
DM: I spend the day with my wife. We talk. She is very prayerful.
Since we got married in 1970, we have never spent this long
[periods] together. In a way it is probably a prayer being
answered now. I find it a wonderful opportunity, first of all to
relax, rest and then to be able to pursue our objectives [for] our
country and our party.
M&G: Do you feel betrayed by your fellow comrades?
DM: Very much so, particularly by the group that is now calling
the shots. If you were to speak about each one of them, you
would find that they [have] skeletons in their cupboards. I
suppose that is why they do not want to have [an] open
dialogue with us.
M&G: Why does Zanu PF appear not to have a succession plan?
DM: It is inbuilt in our Zanu PF constitution. The unfortunate
thing is that the leaders are not given [restrictions on] how long
they may stay in office. In other countries, you become president
of either the party or government for a specified time. Our
constitution is very silent and I believe that it is because of the
respect that we have for our president.
M&G: Will Zanu PF remain stable if Mugabe passes on?
DM: If there is a leader after Mugabe who truly has the desires
and concerns of the ordinary man at heart, I have no doubt that
people will rally behind that person and restore our country to
where it must be.
M&G: As Mugabe’s confidante and one of the last few remaining
leaders from his generation, what legacy does he want to leave?
DM: He has a wonderful legacy. He doesn’t want it to be
compared [to] that of Nelson Mandela because he thinks that
Mandela did not really push to the end. Which is the difference
between the two because Mandela only intended to stop
apartheid. He [Mandela] didn’t want to interfere with what was
going on in South Africa’s economy.
Mugabe’s legacy may come to an end if he doesn’t handle our
cases well. I have lots of respect for him still. When you look
back to his statement of reconciliation after the war, when he
said, “Let us now turn our swords into ploughshares”, that was
wonderful.
He has openly challenged the United Nations [for]
democratising its institutions, and openly attacked Britain and
the United States in the UN. I feel wonderfully impressed by
that.
But it is our party that it has got to democratise itself. You can’t
demand other institutions to be democratised when yours is not
of the same position.
M&G: Is your longstanding relationship with Mugabe now over?
DM: No. In my heart he is still my man. I saw him in prison and
we lived together so right up to now; he is still my man. There is
really nothing wrong between us, he says that I am a fool – fine,
that is his own view. How can I be a fool just suddenly, since
yesterday? I don’t think he means it.
M&G: Was it a fatal mistake for Mujuru to remain silent when
Grace Mugabe attacked her?
DM: I feel for her very much and agree that she should not have
been silent. I think she is probably doing something quietly
through the courts. I don’t know really.
She is a real freedom fighter. She is a very different character
from [higher education minister] Oppah Muchinguri. I suppose it
is because of those differences that she was selected first as
vice-president, and not Muchinguri.
M&G: Is there bad blood between Mujuru and Muchinguri?
DM: Well, yes and no. Yes because Oppah has gone out openly criticising Mujuru, and she has done absolutely nothing in response. People think that is really good, and that is what a married woman should do (unfortunately her husband passed
on).
But she is a typical Shona woman. I admire her and I think she is
a great woman.
Zanu PF is now seized with infighting, rather than addressing
the bread and butter challenges faced by ordinary Zimbabweans.
When you are organised
correctly and your people understand what you are trying to do,
then surely there will be plenty of bread and butter. But at the
present moment, if I may be honest, there is no bread or butter
in this country.
For the rural people their bread comes from the growing of
mealies and when you go around you don’t find much [of it].
Then you realise that these people will have to kneel down
somewhere to beg for their bread and butter. If you have got
any conscience at all, you feel absolutely sad, very sad.
18 Replies to “Mutasa: I Regret My Time In Government”
Comments are closed.
Ipso dipso logic.
Do not take revenge, my dear
friends, but leave room for God’s wrath, for it is written: “It is mine to
avenge; I will repay,” says the Lord. Romans 12 verse 19.
Every
dictator on the planet’s get out of jail clause. They love it,—- and us!
The dear leader knows very
well that we are numb in the head because we await justice in the afterlife.
It’s not going to happen is it? In a past election campaign he went further and
declared, ‘—-if you oppose us you will find yourself 6 feet under’. And he is
Roman Catholic. His party keeps reminding us that, ‘Zanu ndeye ropa’,
Zanu is for blood! Now, ZVAZVIRI, without any shame
you drag the good name of the late John Makumbe, RIP, in the mud and have the temerity
to conclude that his death was a result of his condemnation of Mugabe. Are we
to suppose that if he had been praising Mugabe he would be still alive? Now who is being ‘Satanic’ and I can now fully
understand why our rulers believed diesel could flow from a rock. I repeat, I
will celebrate his demise because he has done untold damage to millions and the
man has blood on his hands unlike the late good professor. So if I die before
he does, what does it prove? A man can swim, a fish can swim but, does it
mean a man is a fish? Ipso dipso logic!
Simon M Tozvireva Chete.
Ipso dipso logic.
Do not take revenge, my dear
friends, but leave room for God’s wrath, for it is written: “It is mine to
avenge; I will repay,” says the Lord. Romans 12 verse 19.
Every
dictator on the planet’s get out of jail clause. They love it,—- and us!
The dear leader knows very
well that we are numb in the head because we await justice in the afterlife.
It’s not going to happen is it? In a past election campaign he went further and
declared, ‘—-if you oppose us you will find yourself 6 feet under’. And he is
Roman Catholic. His party keeps reminding us that, ‘Zanu ndeye ropa’,
Zanu is for blood! Now, ZVAZVIRI, without any shame
you drag the good name of the late John Makumbe, RIP, in the mud and have the temerity
to conclude that his death was a result of his condemnation of Mugabe. Are we
to suppose that if he had been praising Mugabe he would be still alive? Now who is being ‘Satanic’ and I can now fully
understand why our rulers believed diesel could flow from a rock. I repeat, I
will celebrate his demise because he has done untold damage to millions and the
man has blood on his hands unlike the late good professor. So if I die before
he does, what does it prove? A man can swim, a fish can swim but, does it
mean a man is a fish? Ipso dipso logic!
Simon M Tozvireva Chete.
Your glee in anticipation of Gushaz’s death is both macabre and satanic!! Do you remember, once upon a time, there was a chap called John Makumbe who when, the “Nehanda tree” fell down in Harare, couldn’t hide his glee: “zvinoreva kuti pane mukuru achafa” in veiled reference to Bob, but handiti ndiye akazotanga kudonha??!! Hatisafarire kufa kwevamwe; upenyu ndehwaMwari.
Your glee in anticipation of Gushaz’s death is both macabre and satanic!! Do you remember, once upon a time, there was a chap called John Makumbe who when, the “Nehanda tree” fell down in Harare, couldn’t hide his glee: “zvinoreva kuti pane mukuru achafa” in veiled reference to Bob, but handiti ndiye akazotanga kudonha??!! Hatisafarire kufa kwevamwe; upenyu ndehwaMwari.
I think Gushaz was absolutely spot-on to describe Mutasa as “a braying ass”; and I’m convinced that VP Mnangagwa was also very right in saying Mutasa ave kutopenga chaiko. Consider:
1. he now criticises the land reform; yet westerners like Prof Ian Scoones and the world-famous Bill Gates have had to begrudgingly commend our land reform. Even during the time of Rhodesian farmers, it has been estimated that about a third of the land was lying fallow!! In spite of the tremendous govt support, which included interest-free loans for agriculture, it has also been estimated that a third of the white farmers were financially compromised
2. Mutasa now criticises the “look east policy” but he -better than anybody else- should know that after the imposition of sanctions and travel bans by USA and EU, what alternatives did Zim really have except to look east??!!
3. Samaita is clearly suffering from delusions of grandeur!!:… “I’m speaking on behalf of all Zimbabweans who feel a wrong has been done”
4. Mutasa must think we’re all simpletons when he claims to be doing all this altruistically without expecting any personal benefit for himself!! No, he is realising that his meteoric fall from hero to zero in such a short time has stripped him of power, money and influence; and this is what’s motivating him to fight back
I think Gushaz was absolutely spot-on to describe Mutasa as “a braying ass”; and I’m convinced that VP Mnangagwa was also very right in saying Mutasa ave kutopenga chaiko. Consider:
1. he now criticises the land reform; yet westerners like Prof Ian Scoones and the world-famous Bill Gates have had to begrudgingly commend our land reform. Even during the time of Rhodesian farmers, it has been estimated that about a third of the land was lying fallow!! In spite of the tremendous govt support, which included interest-free loans for agriculture, it has also been estimated that a third of the white farmers were financially compromised
2. Mutasa now criticises the “look east policy” but he -better than anybody else- should know that after the imposition of sanctions and travel bans by USA and EU, what alternatives did Zim really have except to look east??!!
3. Samaita is clearly suffering from delusions of grandeur!!:… “I’m speaking on behalf of all Zimbabweans who feel a wrong has been done”
4. Mutasa must think we’re all simpletons when he claims to be doing all this altruistically without expecting any personal benefit for himself!! No, he is realising that his meteoric fall from hero to zero in such a short time has stripped him of power, money and influence; and this is what’s motivating him to fight back
Nxaa what bravery are you talking about here because as far as I understood from this interview Mutasa is still licking Mugabe in a bid to get his job and carry on with corruption.
What locking horns are you talking about here or you meant licking Mugabe devil horns?,Mutasa clearly denies Mugabe is a dictator and instead brands Munangagwa and associates the dictators.
Mutasa finally calls Mugabe a very good gentleman who is being misled by dictators ,Mugabe in turn sees Mutasa as a foolish braying ass gone astray,he wasn’t far from the truth anyway.ZANU pee F sucks.
We are in this political and economic mess because of him and you think his taking Mugabe head-on makes up for all the trouble he has caused? How naive!
We are in this political and economic mess because of him and you think his taking Mugabe head-on makes up for all the trouble he has caused? How naive!
Chisinga
peri chino shura! Everything must come to an end. Why is it when someone
steps on our toes we are the ones obligated to say sorry to the perpetrator?
Cecil Rhodes, after slaughtering hundreds of our people lies at Matopo hills,
the heart of Zimbabwe. Ian Smith and his gangsters got away with it
scot-free! South of the Limpopo the most brutal regime or party was forgiven in
the name of reconciliation. We get trodden on and we forgive . What’s wrong
with us? These guys were racists, if not fascists yet, it is now 70 years since
peace was declared in Europe in 1945 but they are still looking for Nazis even
in the jungles of South America. Not for forgiveness but prosecutions. No reconciliation there! If Ian Smith or Botha
had been brought to book Mugabe and his gangsters would have been thinking
differently. They know they will get away with it because we are too docile. In
fact we are lions led by donkeys or is it arses?
Poor, poor Mutasa, my eyes are welling with tears! How could they treat such a
nice chap in such a horrible manner? He is not even approaching Zimbabweans for
forgiveness but is only interested in worming his way back into Zanu. Who cares
about the ever suffering Zimbabweans? Wakarumwa neche kuchera. If you live by
the sword, ————–! And he seriously wants my sympathy? Someone stop the
world I want to get off! St. John chapter 8, verse 6: ‘He that is without
sin among you, let him first cast a stone at her’. What a lot of crap! I
will throw a mountain if I could. And how many times do we turn the other
cheek? Matthew 5 verse 39. Please, please let Zanu sink in the
flood of their own making. And when the dear leader kicks the proverbial
bucket, let us have the mother of all parties because there is nowhere it says
that we should not celebrate the passing of any evil, cruel and heartless
‘leader’. It will be unforgiveable not to celebrate and I could not live with
myself.
Simon M Tozvireva.
Chisinga
peri chino shura! Everything must come to an end. Why is it when someone
steps on our toes we are the ones obligated to say sorry to the perpetrator?
Cecil Rhodes, after slaughtering hundreds of our people lies at Matopo hills,
the heart of Zimbabwe. Ian Smith and his gangsters got away with it
scot-free! South of the Limpopo the most brutal regime or party was forgiven in
the name of reconciliation. We get trodden on and we forgive . What’s wrong
with us? These guys were racists, if not fascists yet, it is now 70 years since
peace was declared in Europe in 1945 but they are still looking for Nazis even
in the jungles of South America. Not for forgiveness but prosecutions. No reconciliation there! If Ian Smith or Botha
had been brought to book Mugabe and his gangsters would have been thinking
differently. They know they will get away with it because we are too docile. In
fact we are lions led by donkeys or is it arses?
Poor, poor Mutasa, my eyes are welling with tears! How could they treat such a
nice chap in such a horrible manner? He is not even approaching Zimbabweans for
forgiveness but is only interested in worming his way back into Zanu. Who cares
about the ever suffering Zimbabweans? Wakarumwa neche kuchera. If you live by
the sword, ————–! And he seriously wants my sympathy? Someone stop the
world I want to get off! St. John chapter 8, verse 6: ‘He that is without
sin among you, let him first cast a stone at her’. What a lot of crap! I
will throw a mountain if I could. And how many times do we turn the other
cheek? Matthew 5 verse 39. Please, please let Zanu sink in the
flood of their own making. And when the dear leader kicks the proverbial
bucket, let us have the mother of all parties because there is nowhere it says
that we should not celebrate the passing of any evil, cruel and heartless
‘leader’. It will be unforgiveable not to celebrate and I could not live with
myself.
Simon M Tozvireva.
Why is it that these ZANU PF looters see the truth only when they fallen out of favor . Why for 35 years do things that you knew they were wrong? No simpathy for these guys
Why is it that these ZANU PF looters see the truth only when they fallen out of favor . Why for 35 years do things that you knew they were wrong? No simpathy for these guys
Waaal, I am humbled, its as if the person who was interviewed is a different person from the Mutasa I know. Maybe its a good thing that people leave their comfort zones and experience reality. Zimbabweans are struggling and none of those enjoying power seem to be noticing, or maybe they do but they fear being labelled sell-outs once they start highlighting some of these bread and butter issues.
Waaal, I am humbled, its as if the person who was interviewed is a different person from the Mutasa I know. Maybe its a good thing that people leave their comfort zones and experience reality. Zimbabweans are struggling and none of those enjoying power seem to be noticing, or maybe they do but they fear being labelled sell-outs once they start highlighting some of these bread and butter issues.
Wilbert nobody likes what zanu pf did. At least at this point mutasa realises that without the need of you shouting yourself hoarse about it. He should be commended for that. That fact he has decided to lock horns with his former ruthless master shows bravery beyond yours and mine. I find your thou art holier attitude completely depressing. Let this guy go ahead with his actions. He does not need anybody reminding him of how bad is or he was. He knows it and is even confessing in the space above. He is not even asking you or anybody to do a thing. Just sit and watch the drama unfold. That is not too hard. In the end everybody benefits. Remember even Jesus once asked those who were sinless to cast stones at the prostitute and nobody did because no one is perfect.
Comrade Mutasa the whole nation regrets having morons like you and your fellow Zanu PF thugs ruling and destroying everything. You were promoted to such high office as minister and for 34 years you have presided over the corruption, looting and the ruthless oppression of our people. You have robbed the people of their livelihoods denied them freedom, liberty and their basic human rights including the right to a meaningful say in the governance of the country and even the right to life itself.
In your selfish greed you violated the sanctity of human life. Over 30 000 innocent Zimbabweans has been brutally murdered for selfish political gain. You, Comrade Mutasa, your hands are red with the blood of the small boy, Christpower Maisiri, your thugs burnt alive! Did your thugs tell you how he screamed for help?
I hope you and your fellow Zanu PF cabal all burn in hell for what you have done to Christpower and all the others you have murdered and the millions of Zimbabweans who have suffered to gratify your insatiable appetite for power and wealth! No one deserves to inherit the underworld more than you Zanu PF thugs!
Comrade Mutasa the whole nation regrets having morons like you and your fellow Zanu PF thugs ruling and destroying everything. You were promoted to such high office as minister and for 34 years you have presided over the corruption, looting and the ruthless oppression of our people. You have robbed the people of their livelihoods denied them freedom, liberty and their basic human rights including the right to a meaningful say in the governance of the country and even the right to life itself.
In your selfish greed you violated the sanctity of human life. Over 30 000 innocent Zimbabweans has been brutally murdered for selfish political gain. You, Comrade Mutasa, your hands are red with the blood of the small boy, Christpower Maisiri, your thugs burnt alive! Did your thugs tell you how he screamed for help?
I hope you and your fellow Zanu PF cabal all burn in hell for what you have done to Christpower and all the others you have murdered and the millions of Zimbabweans who have suffered to gratify your insatiable appetite for power and wealth! No one deserves to inherit the underworld more than you Zanu PF thugs!